Visitor Comment: Words need to have meaning or all argument becomes nonsense. Either salvation is open to all or it is not. Either it is predestined who goes to heaven or it’s an individual’s choice to choose salvation through Christ. You can not have it both ways and be thinking logically and rationally. The bottom line, the predestination doctrine eliminates the role of an individual’s free will.
Response: Hi and thanks for your comment. However, the Bible does not teach anywhere that natural man has a free will … but rather that his will is in bondage to sin (2 Timothy 2:26; Rom 6:17, 20; 1 Cor 2:14). and since I agree with you that words do mean something, last time I looked, that which is in bondage is not free. Ask yourself, in light of clear biblical teaching, can a person believe the gospel apart form the work of the Holy Spirit? If not, then you agree that, left to himself, man is morally powerless to come to Christ. (i.e. has no free will.) He can make voluntary choices but he sins by necessity. No one coerces him since he voluntarily chooses to sin and yet he cannot do otheriwise until Christ set him free – so until we are joined to Christ by the Spirit we will ALWAYS reject the gospel. And this is exactly what Jesus teaches when he tells us that no one can believe the gospel unless God grants it (John 6:65).
Secondly, it is important to consider that God demands that you obey the ten commandments perfectly? Have you? No, none of us have. That is why we need a Savior … who Himself was without sin having obeyed all God’s commands. He does for us what we cannot do for ourselves. In the same way the command to believe the gospel cannot be obeyed apart from the Holy Spirit. HIs salvation includes delivering us from the bondage of the will. The Holy Spirit gives us a new heart, opens our blind eyes and unplugs our deaf ears … without which we would never come to saving faith on our own. The scripture says no one can say ‘Jesus is Lord’ apart form the Holy Spirit. If someone owes a debt they cannot repay (like us) then the inability to repay the debt does not alleviate us of the responsibility to do so. The point is that you appear to have a lot of unbiblical assumptions in your statement. Back up what you say with Scripture, not just your unaided logic and then we have a place to start.
Please consider this question:. If many of us hear the gospel and some people end up believing and others do not, what makes these people to differ? Are some more natually inclined to the gospel? Are some more wise? No, it is Jesus that makes people to differ. Salvation is by the grace of Jesus Christ alone. If we believe the gospel then it is by grace we have believed. Only a new heart can love and trust Jesus. Faith does not come from an unregenerate heart. We did not come up with faith ourselves. Otherwise we could boast and thank ourself for not being like other men who did not make such a good choice. Our choice is real but requires regenerating grace or we would all perish.
Solus Christus
John
(From Reformation Theology)
You asked the question: “can a person believe the gospel apart form the work of the Holy Spirit?” What exactly is the work of the Holy Spirit? The Bible says in John 16:8-9 that the Holy Spirit would “reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: Of sin, because they believe not on me;” The word reprove means to convict or convince.
In Acts 26:18 Paul said the reason Jesus sent him to preach to the Gentiles was: “To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me (Jesus).” The Holy Spirit convinces a lost person of their unbelief, and the preaching of the gospel also opens their blinded eyes to the truth, but the choice is still up to them.
According to 2 Thessalonians 2:10, if anyone perishes it is because: “they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.” The verse does not say or indicate it is because they could not receive the love of the truth, but because they made a choice not to.
Before you can understand the subject of free will, you need to understand what sets man apart from the animal kingdom, and how we are created in God’s image. Every man, whether saved or not, has three qualities: intellect, emotions, and will.
A lost person may have a sin nature, but he can still make a choice not to sin. If that were not true, what keeps a lost person from killing everyone that disagrees with them, or they get angry with? They make a choice.
Grace allows an oportunity, it does not compel a result. The order in scripture is always hearing the gospel first, trusting in Christ second, receiving life and regeneration third, after they make a choice (Ephesians 1:12-13).
You seem to think that believing is a work, the Bible says just the opposite. Romans 4 states that believing and trusting is the opposite of works.
I just want you to answer one simple question. Do you believe God is smart enough to choose a plan to choose out a people for Himself, that allowed man to have a free will, but still left Him in charge. If you believe He is that smart, then it is just a matter of you not believing that is what God did. That is also a choice.
I have to disagree with predestination. The Bible does say we have a free will. John 3:16 simple put tells us whosoever believes in Him. No need to over analyze this, it’s pretty simple that who so ever believes in Him. It also says in Roman’s if you confess with your mouth and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead you shall be saved. Too many Christians over complicate this to write a book based on a misguided network of scriptures or adhere to an old Calvinistic teaching but I adhere to the what the gospel is and it’s simple. If you can’t explain it to a child you have missed something entirely.
I believe that predestination is the end of a logical argument. If God knows everything then He knows who will chose Him and who won’t before He even creates them. You could then say that God predestines people to come to Him and those He predestines not to. Paul talks about this in Romans. You could also then say that God is responsible for everything that we do b/c He made us that way and therefore God is also responsible for our sin. But we know that God can have nothing to do with sin. Sin is our choice to rebel against God. Therefore, we have free will but God already knows every choice we’ll ever make. But God is also perfectly just, so even though He knows someone will never come to Christ, the CHOICE will always be before them. Look, free will vs. predestination? Let’s just practice getting the basics of Christianity right and ask God about the heavy stuff when we meet Him.
I think it very sad that the obvious Scriptural teachings regarding the will of God and the will of man is so misunderstood as well as other doctrines that are misunderstood resulting in Calvinism, Arminism, and all the other isms. I honestly believe that the seminaries along with reliance on commentary are the cause of much errant doctrine. Tozer was not seminary taught and appears to have greater knowledge than most seminary trained pastors and teachers. (However, I don’t know all the thinking of Tozer so I don’t mean to build him up as a doctrinal expert.) A true understanding of supposed “difficult” doctrines become obvious as a result of tossing out commentaries and studying a few Bible translations and a Strongs type concordance. Most importantly have a willing heart that prayerfully inquires of the Spirit of God to enlighten our minds. This is a slow life study of Scripture – “search the Scriptures daily…” In doing this one will eventually understand the the meat of the Word.
Hi Stan… Thank you for your comment. I think I understand what you are saying. Sometimes it all can seem like so much, that maybe we just need to simplify. Maybe so at times, but the ones gifted to attend seminary or write commentaries are there from God, for our benefit. Look in “a few Bible translations” of your choice and you will see a host of scholars that contributed to those translations. God uses all of us in whatever way He chooses – whether it be Tozer, someone in seminary, or a layperson. -Dani
God, bless our studies as we come to know You more.